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Friday, August 26, 2005

Jewish Jesus & Gentile Christianity

Jew vs. Gentile

In response to comments by Post Liberal that I have missed out the essence of Paul’s ‘revolution’ ie. ‘The continuity’ in relation to Abrahamic Covenant, whereby he argued Jesus Christ was an utterly Jewish figure and that my proposal for Christianity to forget about its non-practical Jewish past but to start from the birth of Christ instead .... as a Marcionite dream!

For those who are not familiar with the word Marcionite, it is a Christian heresy that rejected the Old Testament and denied the incarnation of God in Jesus as a human … The Marcionites also taught that the tetragrammaton did not represent an all-encompassing God, but rather the Hebrew perception of God which was either imperfect, or reflective of an entirely separate deity.

According to the Marcionites, Christ was not the Son of this god, but was sent by Elohim, the name they gave to an all-encompassing and omnibenevolent God. More here

He commented Christianity is a Jewish sect although there isn’t any real essence of Jewish Christianity these days and that Christianity became Gentile per se.

One of my pals commented the prenatal part of Christianity is really nothing more than the Disney collections, intellectually speaking (I disagreed on this portion though …). And since the religion has become ‘Gentile’ whereas God Himself has endorsed the ‘modifications’ (He must have approved ‘gentileness’ of Christianity or no Christians can hope to go to heaven!), so why bother to link back to its ‘incompatible’ past?

I imagine if a perfect religion must have all the parts and pieces, regardless how irrelevant or otherwise nonsense, why wouldn’t Christians go back to circumcision for both boy an girl, in line with what Abraham and Sarah have ‘allegedly’ done, why not also keep a strict Kosher diet and go to church on Friday (instead of Sunday) and better still, rename the church as temple or synagogue.

And my pal also commented if God is happy as ‘El/Yahweh’, why would He want to be reincarnated as ‘Jesus Christ’ the first place? He wanted to promote the concept of ‘establishing a direct relation with God’? Can’t this be achieved by passing the information through a prophet or some other media? Doesn’t this suggest either ‘El/Yahweh’ or ‘Jesus’ could be a fake?

Decision for Minors

You tried to justify that it is perfectly okay for parents to make decision for their children by saying “There are many things in life that we don't understand, there are many times we rely on others. It's because of this that I would advise against condemning religious practices that involve people under a certain age, or - for that matter- of a certain intellectual of critical capacity. What constitutes abusive practice might be moot to some extent, but I'd like to see this decoupled from an apparent total ban on doing things before one can fully 'understand' them. I don't understand all of life, should I stop taking part now on the basis that not everything is chosen or controlled by me?”

Well said my friend but I beg to differ.

Just because you don’t understand is certainly no excuse to let another (equally ignorant) person to take over your life. My opinion is if you don’t know; don’t even think of doing it.

And in the case of circumcision, we do know the facts, it was invented to prevent masturbation and it offers virtually no benefits but only complications! Beat me on this one …

Lastly, you said “Words like 'mystery' can serve as a hiding place for a multitude of abuses” … I say you are simply succinct! This is exactly how some of the holy players hijacked the religion to fulfill their personal interests … Scumbags!

Next, I’d look into Sara’s bit with a new enlightenment from His Almighty.


Blogger postliberal said...

"...so why bother to link back to its ‘incompatible’ past?"

It's not a matter of linking, as if they're two separate things. Even if the gentile Christianity is pretty much the normative Christianity, by a long way, it would be a scandalous thing to then extrapolate that God denies Jewish people their identity. I think it would be taking liberties to assume that since one form of the faith did very well, historically, in terms of numbers, that God must have blessed it over and against another. The first Pentecost was Jewish, where the Holy Spirit flashed into the lives of Jesus' followers with drama, and we can never be allowed to forget that - or to whitewash our stories.

"...if God is happy as ‘El/Yahweh’, why would He want to be reincarnated as ‘Jesus Christ’ the first place? He wanted to promote the concept of ‘establishing a direct relation with God’? Can’t this be achieved by passing the information through a prophet or some other media? Doesn’t this suggest either ‘El/Yahweh’ or ‘Jesus’ could be a fake?"

It does if you want it to. And I have friends, including in my chapel, who'd insist that there's a clear discrepancy between Jesus and the God we see in the Old Testament. But I would go along with others, in trying to see more of a narrative at work. Of a developing relationship between God and humanity, that reached its climax, as it were, in the incarnation. The very event of becoming one of us was in some way necessary, that God had to live humanity in order for a chance of redemption. Life is about more than a message or words - perhaps that's as much why we speak of the divine embodiment.

"You tried to justify that it is perfectly okay for parents to make decision for their children..."

Not quite. What I was trying to do, more, was to point out that individual choice is not the ideal criteria for getting by in life. Saving every element of religion, and life, for the moment when we can make a rational informed decision, based on careful deliberation, is severely unrealistic. As adults we're steeped in enough mystery, confusion, and emotion, to have to acknowledge that there's many things in life we do that aren't 'decided' for ourselves. It's an aspect of infant baptism that informs this - and in the Eastern Orthodox tradition they confirm people into the faith as infants, precisely because they admit that God cannot be bound up by the human mind - even at its greatest extent of 'intelligence'.

Infant circumcision of boys is perhaps questionable in some ways, but I cannot discount it simply in terms of the individuals being unable to decide for themselves. This is a red herring argument used about faith schools, too, where anything that's done involving children is termed a form of child abuse. That's unconvincing, and rests on a lack of realism about the human condition. In this case, any objections would be best kept to the physiological.

8:53 PM  
Blogger La Bona said...

post liberal,

I must admit you are a genius. You must be the hope whom the spirtual world has been waiting for all this while ...

Well said. I look forward to your constructive argument for the good of all.

God must be proud of you ...

4:48 PM  
Blogger postliberal said...

whoa there - don't get too high in your praise! :P Thanks for being so affirming though, I'm most flattered.

6:30 AM  

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WARNING: Blind obsession with prophecy can be perilous or even fatal, reader discretion is advised! Submitted to God as His worldly Activist on a non-exclusive basis since June 15, 2005 1:00 am ET. “La Bona” is a professional name inspired by God; it means "The Righteous", “The Virtuous” or simply “The Good” in Esperanto (a neutral international language). DivineTalk® is an Open Commentary Forum dedicated to God for His Children to engage in dialogue, discourse and debate on laws, standards and values on morality, lifestyle, ethics, business and just about anything else related to their life. God enlightened to have His Words improvised and updated with the prevailing circumstances so that the divine guidance, dogma and policy will evolve with time and stay relevant to His Children in the very era they live in as the way forward. La Bona is a Truth Seeker, Myth Buster, Freedom Fighter, Cyber Activist, Liberal Animal, Good Samaritan, Messiah Wannabe and in order to serve His Children of diverse backgrounds, La Bona is motivated and aim to eventually multitask as Divine Representative, Contemporary Prophet, Celestial Executive, Deity Clairvoyant, Holy Spiritualist ...

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